Take action! Lobby your MP
Jan 13, 18:47
The Home Secretary Jacqui Smith wants to tighten up the law regarding pre-1995 deactivated guns. This represents a potential threat to genuine, law-abiding collectors who have spent years and not insubstantial amounts of money building their collections.
If you want your voice to be heard contact your local MP by email. Their job is to represent their constituents interests. If they don’t know the strength of feeling they cannot fight your corner.
Make sure your MP is aware that the government’s own statistics show that deactivated weapons account for only 0.04% of gun crime. That’s 8 out of 21,521! Of these 8 crimes only 4 involved re-activated weapons.
How to find your MP
Find your MP using theyworkforyou.com. This site will allow you to enter your postcode and will bring up your local MP’s name and ways of contacting him/her. Also contact the home secretary and the shadow Home secretary:
David Davis – Shadow Home Secretary
Papering over the cracks
Quote from David Davis taken from the The Telegraph:
Mr Davis said: “While we welcome any action, however overdue it may be, to tackle the scourge of gun crime the Government’s own figures show that in 2005/06 there were only eight incidents where deactivated or reactivated weapons were used – just 0.04 per cent of gun offences.
“We need sustained action to tackle the other 99.6 per cent of this serious problem, bearing in mind that gun violence has increased four-fold over the last 10 years.”
He added: “The Home Secretary should realise that the public want a rigorous, long-term and holistic approach to the scourge of gun-crime, not ad-hoc announcements which will do little more than paper over the cracks.”
Take action!
It is important that you let your MP know how you feel about this matter. The more people that bring this to their attention, the more likely something will be done about it.
Please add your comments below:
Commenting is closed for this article.
Keep deactivated guns legal, they are prized possessions for the serious collector which cause no harm what so ever. Many deactivated gun lovers will know in great detail the history and origins of their favourite collectors’ pieces and certainly do not use them with any criminal intent.
— Richard Shea · Jan 13, 22:37 · #
To deny honest collectors their collections would be just another poorly thought through idea with which this government has become synonomous. Did the knee jerk reaction to dunblane stop gun crime? No… and neither would this. If you look at gun crime statistics it is obvious that deactivated guns are not really the problem.
— Allen · Jan 14, 08:13 · #
You make the mistake Allen of believing gun crime is a finite measurable thing. Its not. Whilst its true to say that the action after Dunblane did not eliminate gun crime, we cannot speculate at what levels gun crime would be if the law hadn’t been changed. Generally speaking the more you have of anything the more chance there is of someone using it in a criminal manner. There would be less gun crime if there were 10 guns in the country than 1 million. How much less is not something you can work out, but it has to be less.
— Mike Fish · Jan 14, 08:29 · #
Thanks for setting up this site. I wrote to the Home Secretary & both the shadow Secretaries (Tory & Lib Dem) during the run up to the VCR bill last time and I’ll be writing to them again. The Home Office’s own figures show reactivated pre-95 guns were only used in 4 out of 11,084 gun crimes (0.03%)! A ban won’t help anyone, but will just penalise genuine collectors like us.
— Simon Buckley · Jan 14, 08:37 · #
Quite simple ‘Gun’ and ‘Ban’ are seen as vote generators’s. Anything to distract from all the muck flying in the world of polotics. If the law does not serve the people it is a tool of oppresion.
— Tony B · Jan 14, 11:09 · #
I have been a collector of Militaria and Vehicles for many years. The ban of Deacs and the statistics for this reasons are unjust! The compensation claimes if this happen will be huge! mine alone will be many thousands. target real guns! real crime and education of the problem, not guns that dont work!
— Paul Connor · Jan 14, 13:22 · #
Yet another attempt by the labour government to pin the blame for gun crime upon people who collect deactivated guns. I find it hard to believe that people truely think its easy and cheap to reactivate a gun. An uzi for example will cost you about £500 and probably another £500 to reactivate it, yet you could probably purchase one from the black market for about £80. The government wants to be targeting the illegal gun trade and not the passionate hobby of reasonalbly and law obiding people.
— Jason Bates · Jan 14, 15:27 · #
A top-heavy beaucratic UK run by out of touch Ministers trying to justify their inflation busting salaries with knee-jerk proposals to pander to a media indoctrinated underclass. In the process of emigrating to NZ and I will take my MG42 with me………..
— Jim · Jan 14, 16:19 · #
I am an Italian citizen, and a contributor of an Italian gun magazine. I closely follow the British situation, as in Italy, where civilian gun ownership is still allowed, we see Britain as a bad example of how gun control has only made people defenseless against criminals, and maybe against a Police State plan which your Government(s) had ready since quite a while. We have a very restricting law proposal laying here in the Parliament, lately, but that’s not likely to pass.
So, now you are “taking action” to preserve your right to collect deactivated firearms. I wonder what you will do lately, should you win your battle. What Britain needs, IMHO, is to face the facts: post-Hungerford and post-Dunblane legislations have not prevented future acts of madness or stopped gun crime and have somehow helped the situation to get worse for the average law-abiding citizen. That’s what all anti-gun laws do. I have read that the words “Gun” and “Ban” together are vote generators (“Tony B.”). That’s incorrect, my British friends. None of the laws that have eliminated your gun rights within the past 20/25 years have been passed to “stop the madness” actually. There was a serious plan to enact a Police State in the UK, a plan that was ready since a long time, a plan that had the full agreement from both Tories and Labour, and that’s what they are enacting. What the UK needs is to get back with its gun legislation. “Pre-Dunblane” is not enough, that should be “Pre-Hungerford”. And it has to be done as soon as possible, for your own good.
— Pierangelo Tendas · Jan 14, 17:02 · #
Big Brother, gets bigger and bigger, I am so sick and tired of Labours policies on gun crime, They won’t or can’t tackle the real problem, gangs dealing drugs! so the innocent citezen who happens to be an historical collector of deac weapons is attacked again. When will Gordon and his ‘cronies’ realise how many votes labour will lose come the next General election, can’t wait to see them out of power.
— C Rhuon · Jan 14, 17:44 · #
once again utter madness comming from our elected leaders(?) speaking as a VICTIM of successive governments firearms policies, loss of self loading rifle post Hungerford. Loss of pistols post Dunblane. The loss of the right to collect replica firearms after the utterly stupid Violent Crime reduction Bill 2007 , I now find myself possibly looking at the loss and or massive devaluation of my collection of deactivated firearms , I have 11 all bought and paid for when parliament said it was ok to do so,
so why move the goal posts…..again . Its time to question the right to have retrospective laws in this country as one day its fine to have something and the next day its its not. ( sounds like a human rights issue to me !).
I have a firearm certificate and I am ex HM forces and just because a hoodie low life from a sink estate commits a crime why should I be punished…again.
I suppose my collection of bayonets will one day seem deemed illegal…………
— m flynn · Jan 14, 19:01 · #
Here we go again moan moan moan do something about it. I lost all my hanguns in 1997 I have stuck with it with other firearms but who keeps voting these idiots in election after election, present PM excused of course he just walked in because of his mate. Why do we put up with it, were British of course sit back take it up the as! no questions asked. Revolution springs to mind there are ways and means ( petrol strike ?)they always take the soft target option but who is to blame we dont fight back. Do you think this would happen in France Spain etc. imagine the USA with the NRA backing, not like our spineless NRA who could not understand why anyone would need a self loading rifle for target shooting. What I am saying is get off your ass and do something positive instead of moaning and take no prisoners say what you think.
— Jeff · Jan 14, 19:36 · #
LOOK AT THAT STATISTIC: 8 OUT OF 21,521. How can anyone try to justify what this stupid Smith woman is trying to do? I am 21 years old. I bought my first Deactivated weapon when I was 18. Have I wandered around the streets pointing my 1917 Short Magazine Lee Enfield at pedestrians? Have I carried my Webley Mk VI around in public, tucked in my waist band? No, because like almost all collectors of Deactivated weapons I collect as i have a genuine historical interest. I bought my weapons to remember the kids my age who went into battle with the real thing to defend the rights and freedom of the men and women of this country. A country that New Labour is stripping of every good and decent thing that makes us what we are.
— S. Cooper · Jan 14, 19:39 · #
I would like to say that I am truly grateful that Arundel M for starting up this website and for providing us with a collective voice to speak. It is very important to be able to be able to speak to the “powers that be” and explain to them the reasons why we collect these historical pieces. I am also 100 % sure that as collectors, and with a centralised and possibly licensed organisation there will be nothing to worry about at all, both with our pre and post 95 specification deactivated firearms and this as always is smoke without fire, at the very worst they will ban sale of pre 95 spec deactivated guns and how…. I ask will they be able to enforce this? Do they have a record of all the pre 95 guns …and whom they were sold to? …. This still sounds like smoke in the wind…. Will they pay compensation (at the current rates) to persons who legally purchased these items who will possibly be soon be made to feel like criminals? … Humm… sounds a trifle fishy to me. The will require us to form a union which I personally feel is a good thing, an organisation which ensures that we are seen as collectors and all will be fine.
I personally welcome Mike F’s comments that I have seen posted in earlier conversations on this website. It takes a huge amount of courage to be able to post critical comments on a deactivated guns website. However, I’ve got to be honest Mike, you are quite misinformed and in my personal opinion fairly immature in your attitude towards deactivated guns, do you even understand how firearms work? Because if you did, you would also understand that it would take some considerable time and some considerable metalwork skills to get them working again, and quite possibly it would be quicker to build a gun from scratch. I personally do feel that it would be a good thing to “police” the ownership of deactivated guns as they can be a little intimating to the layman, but Mike… to ban them will make NO difference to gun crime in the UK over the next 10 years, not a peep.
I look forward to working with you all over the next coming months and trying to lend as much time as possibly to voicing our opinions and ensuring that we can work out a compromise for the collector and dealer. I still personally believe that very little will change. All the best guys and gals!
Dunk.
— Duncan L · Jan 15, 01:59 · #
Duncan, I have not revealed my own personal situation in this debate but you might find it surprising when/if I do… In the meantime I am providing a counterpoint to some of the inane ramblings that may help focus your minds on the actual issues at stake here.
As to whether or not pre-95 specification is easily “reactivatable”, it depends on your definition of “easy”. The main thrust however of this legislation is to combat what the Greenwoods did. This was very real and if you want to blame anyone for this current round of bans, it is them. That single incident allegedly injected 3000 automative weapons into the criminal underworld. We havent seen them all used yet, but they will be at some point and thats the issue here.
— Mike Fish · Jan 15, 06:54 · #
A BIG thank you to Ms Jacqui Smith & Wesson for her forthcoming proposal on Pre 1995 De Activated Firearms.
When she was asked what the difference between the M1 and M56 was she was heard to say about 65 miles, say no more.
All this will serve to do is drive them underground and greatly increase their value.
All deactivated firearms should be the subject of registration and treated as live weapons but with the added security to genuine collectors that no FAC is required and that their valuable collection is on record.
In that way collectors would be officially recognised and treated as such instead of the potential criminals that the government seems to think we are.
Each collector would be issued with a NFAC (None Firearms Certificate)which must be produced on every purchase and the purchased weapon included on the NFAC.
The cost of this excercise to be bourne by the government as it was their suggestion to change the goalposts of an otherwise harmless expensive hobby.
This suggestion is just to get the ball rolling and is by no means set in stone. Any futher constructive ideas on making our hobby safer would be greatly appreciated.
— Bob Halstead · Jan 15, 08:15 · #
So Mr Fish, (comment 3) taking your arguement further we should ban all kitchen knives and maybe cars as these are used in many more crimes. Anyway, you actually think someone would spend several hundred pounds on an antique to commit a crime when for a couple of hundred they can buy a live pistol with bullets. And, by the way, stopping the flow of illegal arms from E. Europe would be about as easy as getting Turkeys to vote for Christmas twice a year. I think you need a hobby yourself.
— Vic Barnard · Jan 15, 14:54 · #
Clearly someone thought this route was valid for the Greenwoods to be able to sell 3000 pre95 reactivated weapons. That you cannot escape…and thats the problem. Someone else could start up a workshop doing exactly the same again tommorow. This isn’t a theorectical problem!
As for banning cars, knives and other things that kill people, yes I expect that once the gun crime figures are lowered they will go after those too…
— Mike Fish · Jan 15, 15:07 · #
Some points of issue – “There would be less gun crime if there were 10 guns in the country than 1 million.”(Mike Fish · Jan 14, 09:29)
It is NOT about the amount of guns but who has got them and for what purpose they intend to have them for.1 million deactivated guns held by collectors pose little threat against 10 deactivated guns held by gangs Operation Trident was set up for.This topic is about culture rather than guns but in the PC climate we live in the Government would rather take the easy option.
“The main thrust however of this legislation is to combat what the Greenwoods did” (Mike Fish · Jan 15, 07:54) So if guns were imported into the UK via the postal system I assume you would want to ban all incoming international mail ?
Looks like you can’t see the wood for the trees.
— Kev · Jan 15, 15:31 · #
As always there is a reaction by the MP’s that grab the headlines and appear, to the uneducated, that they are doing something for the good. However there are plenty of honest law abiding citizens that legally collect old guns who would be, once again, financially penalised because of their hobby or interest and in some cases business. Yes we all no that gun crime is to be addressed but targert GUN CRIME not the innocent easy soft target. Spend the money where its needed and GET IT RIGHT FOR A CHANGE.
— SD · Jan 15, 15:54 · #
As an Airsoft skirmisher and (I hope to be) ww2 reenactor (airsoft again), I feel for your current plight. As with the VCRA before it, this current ploy is nothing more than an attempt to be seen doing something to combat gun crime.
You have my support and I will be writing to my MP to add my voice to the chorus.
(Though I feel I must point out to Mr.Halstead that a licence scheme to purchase airsoft guns was mooted to the Home Office prior to the VCRA and they didn’t want to pay for or maintain such a database themselves.)
— Dave Harfield · Jan 15, 20:01 · #
Mike F. In some respects I do agree. To deny there is a problem is foolish and plays into the hands of the politicians. But to reactivate 3000 weapons is a criminal offence and baning pre 95 may reduce the number in this country but not the world and they will just source them from elsewhere the same way they source the lve guns for the other 99.96% of gun crime.
No collector wants to see people shot, nobody is debating that crime exists, its just about tackling the problem in an effective and balanced way. On the other threads I suggested the idea of licensing. I like the idea of an NFAC. The more we do to prove we have nothing to hide, the better the outcome will be.
Maybe, if we really put our minds behind this we could improve the situation. If we had a licensed approach to ownrship then maybe they would undo the 95 rule and allow us to buy recently converted weapons without them being welded up. If they were controlled and licensed to the same extent as live firearms then there really would be a win for everyone.
— Simon F · Jan 16, 10:29 · #
Simon, I think you are on the right track there.
If we are to “win” then its going to need something like the NFAC concept.
In the Channel Islands you need a FAC for deactivated weapons for example.
The question however will arise like it did with the VCRA about how much a licencing scheme will cost the government. Oh and then how much it will cost you and I – adding in of course the requirement for secure storage etc etc
No doubt the police will be helpful at this juncture too and say “we don’t want to do this for a deactivated weapon, because its not a weapon”
However, the licencing route is probably the only chance we have of saving the pre95’ers. Its probably that or welding up.
— Mike Fish · Jan 16, 15:08 · #
If the Government are considering a ban on deactivated weapons then this is a disgrace! It is more evidence of the ‘quick fix ‘ legislation mentality that legal gun owners suffered after Hungerford and Dunblane. What they should be doing , instead , is making the penalties for re-activating deactivated weapons so harsh that criminals are very strongly deterred from doing this . The penalties for all gun crime must be made more draconian . I have spent a great deal of time and money on my collection and I will not be best pleased if we are ‘punished’ unfairly yet again!
— WILLIAM EVES · Jan 16, 16:41 · #
Quick reply to Dave Harfield comment 21. Sorry but just to clarify I was talking about deactivated guns and not our Airsoft colleagues whose support we are very grateful for.
I wasn’t aware that it had been muted in the corridors of power the some kind of licensing be raised for Airsoft weapons.
Anyway thanks for pointing it out.
— Bob Halstead · Jan 16, 18:27 · #
Deacts are dangerous only last week I stubbed my toe on a heavy bi-pod.Perhaps they should be kept on a table?.
— Norbert smith · Jan 16, 19:03 · #
I can confidently say that a licencing system for de-acts will be turned down by the Goverment. As mentioned above, a licencing system was suggested for airsoft replicas during the passage of the VCRA. It was turned down. In short, the Government is not interested in anything that would cost money.
Please note; No mention was ever made about handing in of pre-95 de-acts. The word “Ban” was mostly used by the media and the anti-gun lobby. Jacqui Smith wants to ‘restrict’ pre-95 de-acts (the same as the restrictions placed upon airsoft players when the relevent section of the VCRA came into force). I would suggest the owners and users of pre-95 de-acts apply for the same defence as was given to the airsofters to allow them to continue to buy, collect or sell pre-95’s.
— BJ Quick · Jan 16, 19:31 · #
Thanx for the site,these so called power brokers ,whose actual use to the world escapes me,need to concentrate on things that are a real threat to our communitys and come off the horses that are too big for them to be on,I mean,how much do they get paid?give me a break?
— Barry · Jan 16, 20:49 · #
Personally I wouldn’t try and pre-emptivly appease any legislation by volunteering to a licensing system,register or restriction.Make things as hard as possible for the government to whittle away at legitimate collectors and encourage them to take more action against the criminal element.
The Greenwood case has been mentioned as the reason for this but this goes back to 98/99 with the conviction in Jan 2004.Haven’t we had any gun related legislation since then ???
— Kev · Jan 17, 00:42 · #
“Duncan, I have not revealed my own personal situation in this debate but you might find it surprising when/if I do…”
Any relation to you Mike ?
The Association of Chief Police Officers’ firearms spokeswoman, Sue Fish
— Kev · Jan 17, 00:50 · #
Kev,
The VCRA has indeed come along since the Greenwoods case appeared, however the whole chaotic situation of the VCRA probably lost this minor detail.
I suspect the issue here is that the 3000 reacts were not recovered at the time but are starting to surface and make their prescence felt.
I have no idea at this point whether this latest piece is going to be a simple ammendment to the Firearms Act or another “crime reduction” Bill (which will cover everything from joyriding to hoodies).
— Mike Fish · Jan 17, 07:35 · #
Mike, in comment 23 you mention licensing in the Channel island’s. I know jersey weel, should od haveing been my home as a kid. the rules are diffrent for each Island, but in Jersey you can still own handguns etc. The main problem over there is with Knives. Being a smalll enclosed place helps. But there have ben firearm incidents, no knee jerk reaction though from poloticians, they can’t run away from the electrate.
— Tony B · Jan 17, 09:36 · #
Can I encourage everyone to write to their MP about this? I’ve already had a positive response from mine, hopefully an important extra voice if and when it comes to fighting this in Parliament.
— Mike C · Jan 18, 12:49 · #
Oh here we go again, I thought all this nonsense had gone after the VCR bill went through. I don’t see how they can justify this with their own stats showing deacs were only 0.04% of gun crime, they may as well ban bananas as they were probably a similar figure.
As for a register of owners of deac guns I say no. This government has an unhealthy obsession about knowing more about us than we do. It will be a register of kitchen cutlery next! Remember this, they lost 25 million peoples details and more security lapses are coming to light all the time. Would you want a list with your name, address and list of deacs on it floating about god knows where?
These new laws wont make any real difference because they never do. All I need to say is this, are illegal drugs readily available? Yes they are and they are quite cheap as well.
How the hell do they intend to enforce this anyway? No one knows who has what and do they expect people to handover 2 grands of MP40. They could ban the sale of old spec deacs but then I would sell the cert and throw in a “free gift”
There are all sorts of proper things that they should be sorting out and this isn’t one of them.
— Mark w · Jan 20, 01:12 · #
Hi agane,
do you know what you have got when you run out of bullets? a very exspencive club!!
Its not the guns you need stoped its the bullets ? you try and get some!
Reactivate??? has anyone seen the price of lets say a browing hi power £650.00 then go and buy a new barrel ? have the breach and pin rebuilt then just go and buy some BULLETS??? dam this is so much crap!!
this is all pointless the bloody MPs just do as they dam well want to. they always have thay always will when will we stand up and say NO MORE i for one am sick of lisning to the bleeting of us the public its time to stand up and tell the govenment what we want them to do and not the reverce WE vote them in we have to have a say!!
— Paul · Jan 20, 20:20 · #
Please keep your comments on topic and constructive. Abusive comments will be removed.
Copied from this site
You see we can’t even voice are opinion on a web site without being curtailed, what chance do you really think we have, I will give you a nano second to think,
to late none what so ever.
Its the same old problem in the UK ops! sorry Europe big brother nany state
— Jeff · Jan 21, 21:57 · #
Hi,
Deacts are available in Jersey, Channel Islands without a licence (i live there). I think they require a license in Guernsey though.
— Rod · Jan 24, 00:18 · #
I wrote to my MP the moment I heard of this. Like many others interested in shooting as a sport and firearms in general, I’m fed up with being scapegoated for the crimes of those who will choose to ignore any law (outlaws).
With all due respects to the originators of this site, you should resist preaching to the like minded (most of us) and posting here.
Instead, your priority should be to use some of the figures and other useful information contained here then get writing to your MPs, papers and any other bodies/organsisations that you think may be interested.
— Paul R · Jan 25, 21:41 · #
OK, I’m a Bren collector but have many other de-acs, approx 60 now, some are common, others, one of only a few hundred made. Will I be compensated, probably not, will I hand them in, probably not!
Whats the difference between a pre 95 Bren and a post 95 Bren? Nothing! A pre 95 Browning 30 cal and a post 95 30 cal? Nothing! How will that work then!
The most lethal thing I own is a Car, more people are killed each year on the roads in Lincolnshire, than have been killed with firearms in the UK in at least the last 25 years. Why don’t they ban cars…………because everybody has one, and the government wouldn’t commit political suicide on that one!!!
— Chris · Jan 26, 21:43 · #
Having just joined and reading through some of the comments posted I would like to add this,,just last year I was scanning the web and found an armoury site in France who sell piettas and the like blackpowder
guns,,after several emails to and from it was all set for me to have one of these delivered straight to my door no questions asked other than was I over 18 years old…had I had the “cap n balls” to go through with it I could have had a live firearm delivered to my door..I collect Deacs and DO NOT hold a sec.1 or any other,,,surely this is how some firearms are getting in to the UK..I declined in the end as I value my collection of deacs but it did certainly open my eyes as to how easy it can be..
Dvg
— Dave · Jan 28, 15:18 · #
Dave, try it if you are brave enough. I’d give you a 99.9% chance of you needing a new front door and your neighbours seeing you loaded into a van in your pyjamas though :D
— Mike Fish · Jan 28, 22:31 · #
Hi Mike
well thats the bit about cap n balls and lateral thinking,,some might try but I bottled out at the end of the day thinking is it worth it.I even e-mailed one or two police forces and put the question would it be against the law as it is a copy of an antique gun,,you can guess the reply,,and as I dont wear pyjamas the though received a cold shudder/////
— Dave · Jan 28, 23:44 · #
So much for debate. I took the trouble to put forward a reasoned argument and you removed it. It is that sort of attitude that shows you are not interested in cutting down on gun crime but can only think of yourselves.
— steve · Jan 29, 01:42 · #
I apologise for my last comments (43) I was in the wrong blog.
— steve · Jan 29, 02:43 · #
I can’t help it,,banning Deacs would be a complete waste of time and money in my mind,,take this as an example.anybody over the age of 18 can buy an “obselete” calibre antique gun..okay go on the web and for about 100 or so pounds you can buy a reasonable 11mm pin fire revolver,,it will cock and fire,has clear cylinders and barrel,,,look a bit harder on the web and you will find that you can get reloadable brass cartridges in all the popular sizes 5,7,8,11mm ect.also all the bits and bobs required including a loading tool..put it altogether and you have a live firearm complete with six live rounds of ammo,,,albeit a bit dubious item to fire ,I for one would not stand six foot in front of it..and lets be honest, its all out there,,,yes its against the law to have live ammo but there are people who will supply so banning deacs would have little to no effect on gun crime.
I personally would not object to some form of licsense being required to own deacs if we got some sort of recognition.
I see guns as “works of art” from flintlocks and revolvers upto 1870.we all know there are weapons but its nice to own a piece of history as well.
— Dave · Jan 29, 10:27 · #
Legislation against firearms in society is all good, the less guns ( that kan fire and kill people) the better, BUT if you have a history interest and a fascination with guns, such as the craftmanship and so forth, why can´t you buy a inocent piece of metal? It´s been deactivated and can´t do anyone any arm unless you wack someone on the head which you can do with a regular fryingpan? I´m a peaceloving guy who just has a interest in WWII, I wouldn´t hurt a fly.
Thanks / Sinceriely Jesper
— Jesper Lofroth · Jan 30, 18:34 · #
Interesting point Mike your comment #15 you surmise that at some point you can guarantee 3000 Deactivated weapons will be used for a crime. Will they? Yet in comment #3 you inform us that less deactivated guns means less crime statistically. I think perhaps you should consider the factors before surmising, and I quote
“Believing gun crime is a finite measurable thing.” As Allen pointed out in his ‘opinion’ the removal of deactivated guns will have no effect on gun crime, he may have a valid argument, one of which many of the collectors, and re-enactors would endorse. I personally feel that this present government it attempting to legislate against human nature, An impossible task if we look at crime in general. Our prisons would be empty and not at capacity. A criminal is not a member of the law abiding public hence the name criminal he naturally ignores the law and future legislation will be of no consequence. A criminal is resourceful individual were there is a will there is a way. There is not a gun or bullet in this world that will kill another living thing on this planet, until you place the human element behind the trigger. Ammunition and weapons don’t grow on trees, but they are, and will always be supplied by criminals for the benefit of criminals regardless. Should we wish to change this culture we have to look at our culture Deactivated weapon collectors, as far as I am aware, are not criminals (at present) they do however spend a criminal amount of money on the collections.
Criminal, person breaking the law
Collect. n. collector gathers together
— David Main · Jan 30, 19:43 · #
I think we should form and or join “deactivated clubs” up and down the UK..that way me may gather a bit of clout if the ban does eventually come into force,,after all they dont think about banning gun and shooting clubs do they??and I agree 100% with Jesper :post 46:I would rather use a frying pan than put a dent in my Colt…..
— Dave · Jan 30, 22:21 · #
This makes me bl—dy angry to think that jacqui smith who has probably never handled a gun in her life can come up from nowhere and tell us we may loose
our deacs, i hope she will tell the house of parliment gun club that they also will be closed down one day(i think not.)I have collected military items for over forty years, and served in the army and fired many good weapons. I will be
dammed if i will give up my right to collect my deacivated weapons in my own country.
as an englishman i will stand up and fight this
if it comes in.
Dave.
— Dave Pendrill · Feb 5, 19:57 · #
I have collected deacts for over 15 years and own 35 pre 95 deact ive worked in the gun trade for over 13 years. I found out a week before she announced her plans i am boiling mad with the way they persecute good honest people with a perfectly legal hobby i will be sending letters to every mp i can and be talking to a lot of people in my gun company who know a lot of high up mps to try and stop this mad woman
— Richard Shakespeare · Feb 7, 19:33 · #
I am a person who has both deactivated and registered firearms and I can say this I’m starting to get sick and tired of this government trying to lower gun crime by picking on the descent people of this country who abide by the law and who want to be left alone. Does the criminal who uses guns fake or deactivated hand them in when the law changes? I think not, maybe the government should stop picking on people who are law abiding and focus more on tackling crime by placing more police on the streets in the areas where its required.
— Darren Leach · Feb 8, 20:40 · #
WHAT WOULD THE PEOPLE WHO FOUGHT WW2 THINK OF THIS COUNTRY NOW.AS COLLECTORS OF WW2 GUNS WILL NOT BE ABLE TO KEEP THEM.DONT THE GOVERNMENT HAVE ANYTHING BETTER TO DO.I HAVE BEING COLLECTING FOR JUST OVER A YEAR NOW AN I HAVE JUST STARTED A GOOD COLLCTION OF GUNS JUST LIKE EVERYONE ELSE OUT THERE WHO ENJOYS DOING THIS AS THERE HOBBY AN IT REALLY ANOYES ME THAT THE GOVERNMENT HAVE TO SPOIL OUR DREAMS THEY SHOULD FOCUS ON THE REAL WORLD AN DEAL WITH THE REAL CRIMANALS WITH THERE REAL WORKING WEAPONS
— NIGEL SMITH · Feb 11, 20:59 · #
Hi to all some good reading here but is this doing any good ? when is anything going to happen has there been any feed back! to all the comments on all the sites? will anybody stand up and go tell this MP, or shall we sit at home and read site hits! if there are any who have had a gut full of the stelth laws coming into our lives just so the police figers look good on grime provention. then just say NO lets get to gether put our jobs,liberty,and lives on the line the 10s of thousands of WW2 service men and woman who gave there lives for our freedom and the right to have a say in what is in the laws of the UK stand with us .
I for one am willing !!
— Paul · Feb 12, 20:20 · #
Again social issues are being smoke screened with ridiculous legislation.
We have gun crime because there is a serious lack of respect and family life for some sectors in the UK, simple.
Countries with strong social/family values and relaxed gun laws are safe places to live. (Switzerland/NZ/Aus/Canada).
The problem is with our screwed up morals not the deac guns. Yet the politicians can never say that because they’ve created our society and are in the process of making it worse.
— Rich · Feb 14, 11:56 · #
Just to add, not that the UK isn’t a safe palce to live, probably one of the safest in the world actually, people should try and remember that!! (I’ve spent some time in South africa and witnessed what gun crime is like when it’s really out of control!)
— Rich · Feb 14, 12:58 · #
I’m probably an odd-ball, but my interest extends to the varied holsters in which I keep my few deac’s. So at least I shall have something pleasurable left if the guns are ever banned. Unless holsters kept indoors are deemed a threat to society!
— Robbie · Feb 18, 12:01 · #
Following the appalling tragedies of Hungerford and Dunblane successive government initiatives have been to destroy all legitimately held collections, including some priceless antiques and then to pretend they have taken suitable action. The problem is one cannot legislate against the mentally incompetent, or we would have no government at all. It is possible,however, to provide the forces of law and order with the wherewithal to combat illegal arms and their use. Unfortunately for the people of this country it’s far more simple to make token gestures and restrict even further the rights of the normal decent citizens. Of course with the rampant increase in knife crime, thanks to our effete government and their politically correct lackies, it is increasingly likely that it will be illegal in the near future to own a kitchen knife with an edge.
— Alan Hollingdrake · Feb 24, 15:07 · #